Global waming is the observed increase in the average temperature of the Earth's atmosphere and oceans in recent years. Primary causes of global warming, are increased amounts of carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases. Both components are induced by humans and are released into the atmosphere by the burning of fossil fuels, clearing of land, etc.

Rising sea level and changes in precipitation have been directly affected by global warming. These changes MAY increase the frequency and intensity of various extreme weather events namely, floods, droughts, heat waves, hurricanes, tornados, glacier retreat, species extinctions and an increase in disease vectors. Although the above listed events have been occuring, it is difficult to scientifically connect them with global warming. However, only a small minority of climate scientists discount the role that humanity's actions have played in recent warming.

This issue has been a growing political debate, as well as how to deal with the predicted consequences. Please assess these various scientific facts before posting your opinion on the matter:

Fact 1. 2005 was the warmest year since reliable instrumental mesurements became available in the late 1800's.

Fact 2. Increase in greenhouse gases and carbon dioxide are due to both natural or internal processes (solar activity, volcanic emissions) and external processes (humans).

Fact 3. Increase in carbon dioxide in the atmosphere directly leads to the melting of ice near the north and south poles. As the ice melts, land or open water take it's place.

Fact 4. Land and water are less reflective than ice, thus absorbing more solar radiation. This causes more warming in that specific area, which in turn causes more melting.

Fact 5. Higher temperatures, lessened snow cover, rising sea levels effect ecosystems, and forced various species out of their habitats. Other species however, may flourish. Lowering of ocean pH (which is a direct result of increased carbon dioxide) and changing water temperature will have a direct impact on coral reefs.

The possibility that the Earth's temperatures will continue to significantly increase has led people to take various actions in order to retard the process, which are:

1. Energy conservation
2. Alternative energy sources
3. Carbon capture and storage
4. Development of wind power, nuclear power, solar power, hybrid automobiles etc.

Here are some various models I found on wikipedia in direct corrolation to this topic:

1. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/f4/Instrumental_Temperature_Record.png
2. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/c1/2000_Year_Temperature_Comparison.png
3. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e9/Carbon_Dioxide_400kyr-2.png
4. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e5/Glacier_Mass_Balance.png

Please mention your stance on the matter and consider the following questions:

Do you believe that global warming proposes a serious problem to us in our lifetime? Do you feel that this issue should be pushed, or are you sick of hearing about it? If you think this a serious issue, what can we do to help? Do you think anything can be done to completely stop global warming, or is it too late?

I think global warming is a very serious issue. We´ve discussed it a lot at school in the geography class. We even had a small conference about it, where every student represented a different country and told what that country has done to stop global warming. Rising temperatures start to disturb people´s lives already and they don´t seem to be going down. This summer and already last year the whole Europe was feeling the heat and people were literally sveltering. In the future it looks like central and southern Europe will be unbearably hot in the summer and even here in Finland thermometer readings can reach 40 degrees.

The melting of polar icecaps will cause the dissapearing of some entire countries. Mainly some islands, but still some people and cultures are in danger. Also the amount of fresh water will decrease. It already causes wars, so the situation in the future will be horrible.

I don´t think there´s much to do when it comes to stopping the whole global warming, but there are things every country can do to make it advance slower. For example changing energy forms to nature friendlier alternatives like wind power. Also using hybrid cars instead of these we have now would be a big step on the way of a nature friendlier world. Iceland has already started to use such cars, so other countries could follow their example.

All in all, it would be nice if the following generations would have a world to live in. It´s about time people stopped being selfish and started to think about future and other countries too.

Out of curiosity, did they talk about why the USA and Australia have not accepted the Kyoto Protocol? Who were the countries who have done the most to slow global warming?

Well, in our conference there were two guys representing the USA and it was pretty scary to hear that a country that produces the biggest part of all greenhouse gases in the world, has not accepted the Kyoto Protocol. I´ve understood that USA haven´t accepted it because their economy would suffer if they couldn´t pollute the world with the same speed as now. With no offence, but I totally disfavour those countries that haven´t accepted the Kyoto Protocol. But you probably know the reasons of the USA best, so please tell me.

I have no idea which countries have done the most to slow global warming, but of course it´s easier for those countries that already use much solar-, water-, or wind-based energy. I know Iceland´s case the best and they have already done much to slow global warming. And they have to, because if the glaciers in their country start to melt, like they already have, the people will drown. And the Kyoto Protocol has no use, if te countries that have accepted it don´t do anything. I know it takes a lot of time, but Finland for example hasn´t done much yet.

For future reference, you don't have to be so P.C. when talking about the USA government and economy to me. I appreciate the respect but in regards to this issue, and MANY other issues, our country has fucked up beyond correction. Every country could never use petrol again and we'd still go down in flames because of the USA. The interesting thing is, if we lived in a TRUE democracy, it wouldn't be that way. 95% of people I talk to are against our current environmental policies.

The only thing we can basically do is vote a better person into office (in two years). Along with getting the majority of the house of representatives and congress to agree on accepting the protocol as well. Or...at least something like it. The reason why I'm STILL skeptical is because regardless of what an American politician "says" they're about, they do what the people who are funding them say. Since both main parties are usually funded by the SAME FUCKING PEOPLE....(wealthy owners of corporations), it would take someone to have their own funding, or just say fuck you to them. Which won't happen...because people involved with Exxon Mobil and other like industries rule our country.

The best long term solution to fight a Democracy that doesn't work is by having people purchase hybrid cars and other things that will slow global warming. If everyone got gas from BP, and bought Toyota hybrids, then those companies would take over the ones now, and the politicians would be funded by companies that ACTUALLY care about the world. But this could take years...

Did they say anything about Australia?

No, nothing about Australia. I didn´t take part in a bigger conference held in Vantaa, Finland last year, where some students from our school and others from all around Finland discussed the global warming. There were some foreign people talking and the lectures were held in English, so I guess Australia was mentioned there. But I suppose you know also Australia´s situation better...

It´s nice to know that there are so many people in USA against the politics of George W. Bush. But as you said it´s hard to make changes. I just wonder what´s the matter with those politicians. Can´t they see that the world we live in is about to be destroyed if we don´t do something and quick.

I think there´s one thing we all could do to halt the global warming and it´s using public transport. Most people drive even short distances alone in their own cars. Using public transport would be not only cheaper but also nature friendlier. My friend has just returned from USA after spending a year as an exchange student there. She said that people hardly ever walk anywhere, no matter how short distance it is. Always by car. Of course people in small villages need a car to get from A to B, but people in big cities could stop using their cars and walk, cycle or use the public transport instead.

I really don't know anything about Australia not accepting the treaty...and I can't see why they wouldn't. It's actually not entirely George W. Bush. I'm against his policies as well, but like I was trying to explain earlier, they're not exactly HIS policies. They are the policies of Exxon Mobil and other like companies. Bill Clinton actually declined the Kyoto protocol as well...

Oh...ok. He was just the first "idiot" that came in to my mind. It must be pretty complicated when the money comes from big companies. Quite corrupted I´d say.

Anyway, I don´t think China has accepted the Kyoto protocol either. They are producing more and more emissions all the time and if the Chinese will become richer and they all buy a car, this world won´t survive anymore.

yes it annoys me greatly how the Kyoto agreement was not signed by Bush
that is one of the main reasons why i dislike him. it shows his typical attitude doesnt it

tell me. what was the american public thinking keeping him power?

It really wouldn't matter...all but few of the politicians do whatever the people that fund them want. Unfortunately, they are all funded by the same corporations. So consider Bush somewhat of a red-herring if you get my drift. Clinton also declined the agreement. I'm not defending them...but the way our economy is based around oil...it wouldn't be easy for any president to sign. Although, someone OTHER than Bush would be more likely to....oh well...two years left.

haha yes. it is all a bit of a no hope situation. i cant see any american signing the agreement, and thats where a lot of it all comes from wit hall of your big trucks and whatever over there. haha
i guess we will just have to see what happens
scientist predictions might be wrong after all but i seriously doubt it

if it doesnt affect us, it probably certainly will out offspring if we were to have any

For real man, the biggest trucks in Europe would feel threatened by our small ones. I'm all about economy cars...but I could DIE pretty easily considering I use the most dangerous highway in America I-95. But Toyota is now the #2 Car company in America. Last year, it was #4. Says that some Americans care at least.

i believe i made a topic about this in the serious section. well, it was over population, taht is leading to pollution, which is leading to global warming

I wanted to get more specific, because although most people see "global warming" as a problem, some do not see over population and pollution as a direct cause for global warming. There are many (right wingers) who think the planet is naturally getting warmer just as it has done in the past. Therefore, I wanted to provide scientific evidence for such warming and also provide a means for people to discuss the issue directly.

Just as there is a Religion and Spirituality thread, there are also threads on Christianity, Satanism, Islam and Judaism in the Serious Discussions Forum.

Oh, and I live in Florida, Hurricane Alley...so I'm partial to this issue.

do american people still think that there is no global warming???

if we wont clean our oceans we all gona die in 50 years because we wont have enough oxygen so fuck global warming^^

A good example of what might become of this planet, if the pollution continues, is the planet Venus. The atmosphere consists 95% of carbon dioxide(CO2) and the temperature is around 500 C. It is an exaggeration but still, it doesnt change the point, in my opinion.

In addition to U.S., countries like China and India might pose an even bigger threat to the ecosystem in the future. It is sad, that corporations sponsor politicians in most places, thus making the politics and of course they dont support reducing CO2 emissions, because it would make less profit.

I think that it is a serious issue and people ought to do something towards it even individually, spend and consume less, walk more(I know I am not a good example myself, because I use computer for quite pointless purposes, but I try to improve, walk more etc.), Im not meaning becoming complete ascetics etc. but I think that the waste of resources and consuming is ridiculously over the top now. I often find people with attitudes that it is pointless to do something, because all their efforts are nothing compared to the pollution of big corporations, and it is pointless to do something if others dont. But I think that every change starts in an individual and if someone doesnt want to contribute to the change, then he doesnt want the change to happen in the first place.

It might be too late to stop it but at least it can be slowed down, and maybe the situation can even get under control in the future. I havent researched this subject very much so I dont know everything about all kinds of facts, treaties and the likes. It might not affect us but it is very selfish, in my opinion, to take away the freedom and habitats of all the other species and our children for some comfort, because I think this planet doesnt only belong to humans but to everyone. I think that this native American saying is good(I saw it in Civilization 4): "We do not inherit the land from our ancestors, we borrow it from our children." and it wouldnt do bad to think about it.

A friend told me that in Norway, they are planning to prohibit cars that use petroleum, although I dont know when. It might cause some discomfort at first but I think it is very good in the long term so I think it is a good step although I havent read this news and Im not even sure whether it is true, or he was mistaken.

Written by baldur on 24.05.2007 at 14:54

do american people still think that there is no global warming???

if we wont clean our oceans we all gona die in 50 years because we wont have enough oxygen so fuck global warming^^

Don't believe everything you hear on the News at your local Hauptbahnhof or whatever you read in Bild. Global Warming is definitely a serious problem...and a lot of the people trying to fight it are American. They just don't quite have the support of the government currently.

Written by Konrad on 28.05.2007 at 13:04

Written by baldur on 24.05.2007 at 14:54

do american people still think that there is no global warming???

if we wont clean our oceans we all gona die in 50 years because we wont have enough oxygen so fuck global warming^^

Don't believe everything you hear on the News at your local Hauptbahnhof or whatever you read in Bild. Global Warming is definitely a serious problem...and a lot of the people trying to fight it are American. They just don't quite have the support of the government currently.

what i wanted to say is that we ve got bigger problems than global warming for example our dirty oceans

Oh, I think I misunderstood you then. I don't really know what is worse...the Dirty Oceans...or the extremely HOT oceans which cause more and more intense hurricanes every year.

I think global warming is a bit like the Y2K bug... If you wana survive the next 100 years you better buy lots of this stuff....

Im not saying that its not happening... It is, but i think some politicians want to exaggerate it a bit.

I totally support global warming. I mean, in the last Ice Age glaciers came down from the arctic and totally chewed up the American landscape. Seriously, there were these nice valleys in central New York, but oh no, the glaciers had to come and rip up the ground and make these mountains and lakes.

Well it is pay back time glaciers. Global Warming! Take that you fucking glaciers!

: I guess it's okay to make funny of anything else except one certain religion.

@baldur
dying seas (as baltic sea) and global warming is related to each others, not only the pollutions kill the sea but also the raising temperature which lowers the PH of the water so I think it's equally important to try to rescue the seas and fight against global warming.

@Konrad
You're absolutely right, as much as we like to blame on Bush for this and that, he has very little to do about those thing personally. He is just another corporate puppet, people who brings the money to the game also set the rules and why would they set rules that makes their business harder/impossible.. that's just how it is.
I think India is getting even bigger threat to this globe than U.S, 1,1 billion people living in a big huge dumpster, they have no official environmental plans, their pitiful garbage disposal system is not working so basically the streets are covered with trashes and they don't have have any commitments or responsibilities at present for reducing the emissions of greenhouse gases.. this is a standard over all in Asia but specially the condition of India with the huge economical growth is quite troubling.

Then again it's not quite working in Europe either, for example my gov is not supporting individuals' acts against global warming for example "green cars" such electric cars, not only that you won't get tax cut-backs but you'll actually have to pay more taxes for electric cars! Hybrid cars are rather new thing and isn't available for everyone yet so they haven't figure out any taxes for those to a date but ask me again in six months lol

I do know that the gov of Norway gives major tax cut-backs if you drive electric or hybrid cars.. but then again, they're not part of EU and can make such a decisions on their own.. lucky bastards.

Hmm...funny since I rip on Christianity more than anyone else I know...

I made that joke about global warming because I feel people need to lighten up about it. I have been to several seminars where people were freaking like the world was going to end tomorrow.

Chill Out!

First, there is too much controversy over global warming to even say 100% it is happening. Second, if it is happening, why have I head dozens of different theories as to what will happen in the future? Nature has a way of correcting itself. If we begin switching fuel sources, creating more "environmentally safe" products, etc. then we can hopefully help the planet turn the planet around.

But acting like a bunch of chickens with their heads cut off isn't going to fix anything. For me, I am not going to worry about the future. I can no more control what will happen tomorrow than I can a million years from now. Heck, for all I know, the planet could be destroyed next week!

Now I am not saying we should trash earth. Of course we need to take care of the planet. But it will only be done with maturity and patients. Too many people want to turn planet-care into a political scheme. That is not the way to do it. I have seen our local Boy Scout troops do more for the planet that Al Gore!

Seems like i can only agree with hemlock here .

Written by baldur on 28.05.2007 at 13:36

Written by Konrad on 28.05.2007 at 13:04

Written by baldur on 24.05.2007 at 14:54

do american people still think that there is no global warming???

if we wont clean our oceans we all gona die in 50 years because we wont have enough oxygen so fuck global warming^^

Don't believe everything you hear on the News at your local Hauptbahnhof or whatever you read in Bild. Global Warming is definitely a serious problem...and a lot of the people trying to fight it are American. They just don't quite have the support of the government currently.

what i wanted to say is that we ve got bigger problems than global warming for example our dirty oceans

come on, even if all oxygen creating organism died at the same time, theres still enough oxygen for us for over a millenia.

Written by Konrad on 23.08.2006 at 20:52

Fact 1. 2005 was the warmest year since reliable instrumental mesurements became available in the late 1800's.

yes quite possibly, but 200 years are not enough for reasonable analysis of change in climate. and of course the less reliable studies about pre 1800 temperatures, say that in middle ages there were similar "hot era" to ours. and since 16th century to about 19th (dont have precise numbers, if you wish i can get them). there was something called "little ice age". you could actually skate on river Thames in winter back then. that doesnt mean that this fact is incorrect.

Quote:

Fact 2. Increase in greenhouse gases and carbon dioxide are due to both natural or internal processes (solar activity, volcanic emissions) and external processes (humans).

correct. altough its still debated how much effect the human part has. plus CO2 is somewhat unsure in this equation. many studies say (i can get some of them if you wish) that in many cases CO2 FOLLOWED! the global warming, not that it started it. plus there were times when actually CO2 level was pretty high, and average temperature much lower, than it would suggest. and vice versa. so this matter its not entirely certain.

Quote:

Fact 3. Increase in carbon dioxide in the atmosphere directly leads to the melting of ice near the north and south poles. As the ice melts, land or open water take it's place.

yet quite possible. north pole actaully matters less than south, since its floating ice, so it wouldnt induce any drastic raise of sea level. of course it works as one of the stabilizers of climate, no objetction here. quite surprisingly, guess why Greenland is called a Greenland? because when vikings came there it really was a Greenland, they even found villages in permafrost! (remember the middle ages part?). of course melting must have its limits, it wouldnt be too great if Antarctis melted. that would really be a problem.

Quote:

Fact 4. Land and water are less reflective than ice, thus absorbing more solar radiation. This causes more warming in that specific area, which in turn causes more melting.

yes quite possibly, i cant add anything to this

Quote:

Fact 5. Higher temperatures, lessened snow cover, rising sea levels effect ecosystems, and forced various species out of their habitats. Other species however, may flourish. Lowering of ocean pH (which is a direct result of increased carbon dioxide) and changing water temperature will have a direct impact on coral reefs.

yes it quite possibly will have. about the species. variety of organisms keeps changing since the beginning of life on earth. no one can even think about fixing it at one precise points. some spiecies die, some spiecies emerge. of course, we should try to make the human part in this not too big compared to other things. i wouldnt eat salmon "just because i like it" (i dont eat much fish anyway, but good example) if i knew that number of salmons is decreasing rapidly, so they might become extinct.

Quote:

The possibility that the Earth's temperatures will continue to significantly increase has led people to take various actions in order to retard the process, which are:

1. Energy conservation
2. Alternative energy sources
3. Carbon capture and storage
4. Development of wind power, nuclear power, solar power, hybrid automobiles etc.

not that bad, but as hemlock said: "acting like a bunch of chickens with their heads cut off isn't going to fix anything". i myself am pro nuclear power, since it became quite safe since people harnessed it for the first time. hybrid cars? no problem. energy conservation? it depends on how much itll cost. it isnt cheap, and after all. the less money is generated, the less money can be spent on such tasks. carbon capture and storage? ok why not, again the same problem as energy conservation.

Quote:

Here are some various models I found on wikipedia in direct corrolation to this topic:

1. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/f4/Instrumental_Temperature_Record.png
2. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/c1/2000_Year_Temperature_Comparison.png
3. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e9/Carbon_Dioxide_400kyr-2.png
4. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e5/Glacier_Mass_Balance.png

Please mention your stance on the matter and consider the following questions:

Do you believe that global warming proposes a serious problem to us in our lifetime? Do you feel that this issue should be pushed, or are you sick of hearing about it? If you think this a serious issue, what can we do to help? Do you think anything can be done to completely stop global warming, or is it too late?

I STRONGLY SAY !NO! TO THIS:

Quote:
"Do you think anything can be done to completely stop global warming?"

AND I SAY WE SHOULDNT EVEN TRY TO STOP COMPLETELY!

in the end im like this (quote by hemlock): Now I am not saying we should trash earth. Of course we need to take care of the planet. But it will only be done with maturity and patients. Too many people want to turn planet-care into a political scheme. That is not the way to do it. I have seen our local Boy Scout troops do more the planet that Al Gore!

Global warming is a very serious issue. If it is as bad as they tell us, we're gonna be very fucked. It's kindda sad that we will die because our success, like viruses in an almost dead body. Anyway rightnow the best solution for global warming is a nuclear winter, as it seems its gonna be (the norht koreanswith the bomb, the iranians trying to get it, and the russians are now in a cold war mood)

@Angelique...

Yes China and India are much bigger problems than the US...but the US actually could do something about it if they wanted to. China and India are hopeless...

I don't think, that it's a very serious problem. I mean, that exist different theories. Now we live at the Ice Age. It's only local warm period in this Ice Age. And I don't think, that the major cause of Global Warming is a evolving of greenhouse gases. Maybe, the cause is a cyclical fluktuation of solar activity. Then this activity increase the atmospher temperature increase too.
And I think, that Kyoto Protocol is just political istrument for pressure on some contries.

PS Sorry for my english.

Written by akatana on 12.06.2007 at 13:47

Nature will have us in the end, unfortunately it will take revenge on all of us not just those that are to blame.

I really like that. I have some talks on tape of American Indians from various tribes. They believe the world is a living organism...and that it is really hurting right now because of Humans and is going to start doing all that it can to cleanse itself of whatever problems or diseases it has...like an immune system. Obviously Al Gore can make more logical cause and effect statements that say the same thing...but they are more confusing. I kind of like the Hokee indian prophecies a bit more. :

read the State of Fear by Michael Crichton...at least you'll see another point of view...

The problem here, as always, are the politicians and the huge trasnational enterprises, in order to obtain more money and/or power, they always misguide the truth, making it worse or lighter, but i think that one thing should be clear, THERE IS GLOBAL WARMING, like it or not. It true that the result cant be predicted, but that shouldnt be a reason for not making anything. And if you dont care about, for me theres no problem, the countries that will go to hell, are the northern and southern, and i dont live on any thats there. For me better, less blood sucking contries.